Dining across the divide: 'We disagreed on almost everything – it was great'

Richard, 52, Gainsborough

Occupation Shift manager

Voting record Voted Labour in the 90s, in the 2010s went Conservative though never liked them, will now vote Reform

Amuse bouche Lives in a Georgian mansion that was built in 1776. It’s hard to heat. Sometimes he has to sleep in his overcoat

Joe, 37, Sheffield

Occupation Works for an NGO

Voting record Was a Labour member during Jeremy Corbyn’s leadership. Was expelled in 2023 for being a member of Labour International Left Alliance, voted Green in 2024, and backed Zack Polanski for the leadership

Amuse bouche Speaks Vietnamese and has a Vietnamese motorbike licence but no British driving licence

For starters

Joe I was expecting a Rotherham rioter, but he was a very nice guy.

Richard I liked the cut of his jib. He was very friendly, personable and likable.

Joe We shared garlic bread and olives. I had a fillet steak and prawns.

Richard I had steak and roast potatoes.

The big beef

Joe He’s a classic Thatcherite, believes in very low taxes and no public spending, really, except in the defence sector. He was saying public services are all crap, everything’s collapsing, we’ve got a high tax burden and his answer was just to abandon it all. I said no, that was because of austerity. Because of Cameron, because of Truss: the fabric of communities in Britain has been torn apart because of all the damage that’s been done by Conservatives. We need to rebuild it with taxes, including a wealth tax.

Richard If they reduced taxes, the government would get more money – that’s been proven throughout history. High taxes are a disincentive to work. The main parties don’t get aspiration. There are too many people on welfare, and they’re going to have to accept less, going forward. Joe believes in a wealth tax. We were on comparable salaries, and he said: “The people richer than us will pay this.” My view is that that’s not true. He would describe me as an ideologue; I would describe him as an idealist.

Joe He believes in trickle-down economics. I said the past 40 years have shown that doesn’t work, and you need taxation and state investment if you want new industries. Something like green steel is going to come from massive state investment in the first place.

Richard We both agreed public services had been hollowed out since 2010. The reason we could afford them prior to that, though, is that we had a throbbing economy and now we don’t. In order to get a throbbing economy, we need to reduce taxes and get people being entrepreneurs again.

Sharing plate

Joe He has left-field views on migration; not leftwing, left-field. He thinks there should be free movement between the UK and our former colonies.

Richard I said: “Despite all its faults, I’m an empire man.” I accept that it did horrendous things and we have to atone for it, by having a responsibility to our kith and kin in the Caribbean, west Africa, India. We should be concentrating there. I sympathise with refugees, but we can’t afford to be the repository for every waif and stray.

For afters

Joe He thinks that since Britain’s not one of the worst actors when it comes to climate – we account for 1% of global emissions – we shouldn’t be bothering to do more. I said: “Hold on, we have these predictions that if we don’t do anything about climate change, it’s going to wipe out 50% of global GDP.”

Richard I believe that climate change is happening; I’m not a denier. But I don’t believe in squeezing our standards of living while other countries burn coal profligately. I believe the market will come up with a solution, because it always has.

Takeaways

Joe We went to the pub after dinner. We got on really well, actually. I am a politics obsessive, but it’s always within the leftwing space. The most rightwing people I know are Labour supporters. It’s rare to have an evening with someone who disagrees with me on almost everything. I had a great time.

Richard We had a few more pints and agreed to meet up next time I’m in Sheffield. He wants to introduce me to some of his friends who are more leftwing than him. I’ve got friends who are more rightwing than me. He’s a good guy. He’s a cracking lad.

Additional reporting: Kitty Drake